The Buddhist Hour Radio Broadcast Archives

Buddhist Hour
Script No. 373
Radio Broadcast live on Hillside 88.0 FM
for Sunday 20 March 2005CE
2547 Buddhist Era


“Selflessness, Anatta.”


Today’s talk is on the subject of ‘Anatta’, which is a uniquely Buddhist doctrine. The Buddhist Dictionary, written by the Venerable Nyanatiloka, defines Anatta as: ‘Not self, non-ego, egolessness, impersonality.’

The issue of ‘No self’ is of crucial importance within the Buddhist doctrine, and although it is a difficult teaching to master, one must come to a correct understanding of it to realise the sublime and liberating qualities of the Buddha Dhamma.

We will begin by reading the Anattalakkhana Sutta, the discourse on the ‘not-self’ characteristic, which was originally written in the Samyutta Nikaya 22, 59.

I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying at Varanasi in the Game Refuge at Isipatana. There he addressed the group of five monks:
"The body, monks, is not self. If the body were the self, this body would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible (to say) with regard to the body, 'Let my body be thus. Let my body not be thus.' But precisely because the body is not self, the body lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible (to say) with regard to the body, 'Let my body be thus. Let my body not be thus.'
"Feeling is not self. If feeling were the self, this feeling would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible (to say) with regard to feeling, 'Let my feeling be thus. Let my feeling not be thus.' But precisely because feeling is not self, feeling lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible (to say) with regard to feeling, 'Let my feeling be thus. Let my feeling not be thus.'
"Perception is not self. If perception were the self, this perception would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible (to say) with regard to perception, 'Let my perception be thus. Let my perception not be thus.' But precisely because perception is not self, perception lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible (to say) with regard to perception, 'Let my perception be thus. Let my perception not be thus.'
"Mental processes are not self. If mental processes were the self, these mental processes would not lend themselves to dis-ease. It would be possible (to say) with regard to mental processes, 'Let my mental processes be thus. Let my mental processes not be thus.' But precisely because mental processes are not self, mental processes lend themselves to dis-ease. And it is not possible (to say) with regard to mental processes, 'Let my mental processes be thus. Let my mental processes not be thus.'
"Consciousness is not self. If consciousness were the self, this consciousness would not lend itself to dis-ease. It would be possible (to say) with regard to consciousness, 'Let my consciousness be thus. Let my consciousness not be thus.' But precisely because consciousness is not self, consciousness lends itself to dis-ease. And it is not possible (to say) with regard to consciousness, 'Let my consciousness be thus. Let my consciousness not be thus.'
"How do you construe thus, monks -- Is the body constant or inconstant?"
"Inconstant, lord."
"And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"
"Stressful, lord."
"And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"
"No, lord."
"How do you construe thus, monks -- Is feeling constant or inconstant?"
"Inconstant, lord."
"And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"
"Stressful, lord."
"And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"
"No, lord."
"How do you construe thus, monks -- Is perception constant or inconstant?"
"Inconstant, lord."
"And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"
"Stressful, lord."
"And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"
"No, lord."
"How do you construe thus, monks -- Are mental processes constant or inconstant?"
"Inconstant, lord."
"And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"
"Stressful, lord."
"And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"
"No, lord."
"How do you construe thus, monks -- Is consciousness constant or inconstant?"
"Inconstant, lord."
"And is that which is inconstant easeful or stressful?"
"Stressful, lord."
"And is it fitting to regard what is inconstant, stressful, subject to change as: 'This is mine. This is my self. This is what I am'?"
"No, lord."
"Thus, monks, any body whatsoever -- past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every body -- is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'
"Any feeling whatsoever -- past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every feeling -- is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as:
'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'
"Any perception whatsoever -- past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every perception -- is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'
"Any mental processes whatsoever -- past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: all mental processes -- are to be seen as they actually are with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'
"Any consciousness whatsoever -- past, future, or present; internal or external; blatant or subtle; common or sublime; far or near: every consciousness -- is to be seen as it actually is with right discernment as: 'This is not mine. This is not my self. This is not what I am.'
"Seeing thus, the instructed Noble disciple grows disenchanted with the body, disenchanted with feeling, disenchanted with perception, disenchanted with mental processes, & disenchanted with consciousness. Disenchanted, he becomes dispassionate. Through dispassion, he is released.
"With release, there is the knowledge, 'Released.' He discerns that, 'Birth is depleted, the holy life fulfilled, the task done. There is nothing further for this world.'"
That is what the Blessed One said. Glad at heart, the group of five monks delighted at his words.
And while this explanation was being given, the hearts of the group of five monks, through lack of clinging, were released from the mental effluents.

We now continue with the next part in our series of transcribed Buddha Dhamma talks spoken by John D. Hughes at the Buddhist Discussion Centre (Upwey) Ltd. during a five-day meditation course in June 1988.

The talk is entitled, ‘Selflessness, Anatta.’

The teaching begins with one of John’s students relating her experiences of meditation on selflessness, or Anatta, with John commenting throughout. Finally, he gives further instructions to his students on the subject of selflessness.

The student begins:

This evening we are discussing Anatta and this is the sense of being totally without ego and most of us, in fact all of us, have come to the Buddhist Discussion Centre because we are suffering pain, despair and our various other problems that are too difficult for us to handle by ourselves.

Now, we come here for help from John and then we listen to him and we try very hard, we try very hard to follow those teachings and put them into practice, but most of the time the basis on which we build this practice is an ego base. We come here because we are in pain which is caused by ego, our thoughts centre on what passes for Self and so we say, "This hurts us", or "We can't cope with this", or "We want help, hat can you do to help me"? And then you say "I will try", "I will help other people", "I will be kind", "I will give flowers", "I will light candles", and the rest of the things that we do. And these are all really quite praiseworthy in themselves if they were not tied to an ego base.

But if you do these things with the idea behind it of saying that "I will benefit from lighting a candle", "I will earn merit from giving flowers", "Aren't I kind for helping so and so, I gave them time, my time is precious", "Nobody knows how much effort I've put in", and all the rest of the things that most of us say to ourselves. And then we get upset if our efforts are not recognised. We get hurt when we're told that we're not trying enough. I think I can speak for everyone over there.

And the thing that is holding us back in our practice is this very strong sense of 'I', "What am 'I' getting out of all this? So that then in effect you are defeating of your own efforts by making it ego based. If, when you give your flowers, you give them for the benefit of other people, other beings, other sentient beings, without any sense of what you will get out of it or any sanctimonious feeling of doing good, then that action is the one that is most meritorious and is going to help you on your path much more.

So that what you have to do, what we all have to do, is to understand that this ego is simply a kammic package, it is a product of what has gone as the residual of many lives that we've had before and also of what we're building for the future. So if we build for the future on an ego base, then one simply perpetuates the kammic package that one has inherited rather than changing it in any meaningful way at all. So the essence of practice then is to get rid of the ego because when one does that, then the merit, it's almost as though you stop doing things for what you can get out of it.

And then once you do that and drop that ego then the merit becomes a sort of free-flowing form that just goes on and accumulates merit because there's nothing else it can do because it's not based in anything that is tied to this, this ego that is searching for some identity all the time and some sort of reinforcement through trying to do good.

JDH: So that type of merit is never consumed. An inexhaustible supply. Thank you.... Triple Gem Refuge how it came that time when you did it different to any other time.

Female student: Well, I felt, I felt completely without an ego that time.... and I wanted to very much, when I say 'I' ....

JDH: That's conventional.

Female student: It's conventional.

JDH: Your mind knows what it's looking at.

Female student: I wanted very much to pay respect, I was so filled with, with gratitude and a kind of awe that such a thing could happen and I know that I couldn't do it on my own and that John helped me very much and that John is, John is Dhamma and I wanted to pay respect to it very much. In fact, it was sort of compulsive. It almost happened without me knowing.

JDH: Yes, because it's so much you want to pay respect to the combination, which happens to be manifest here, of the Buddha Dhamma Sangha which got you through patient long, long training to see for yourself. So therefore, it is spontaneous, minus ego. And therefore such a thing with intention, there's still intention there, is correct.

Because of that, because of that, that connects you forever until your Samsara ends, to the Buddha, Dhamma, Sangha. So you have security. Now you might see with that mind the, why I say, is a choice of words, loyalty to Dhamma practice, loyalty to Dhamma culture, is a choice of words.

Female student: I thought of immersion.

JDH: Yes, well it depends on your kammic thing but you can see what I mean that something so beautiful you would never turn away from. Because it would be, like the mind, the thought can't enter the mind. So you find security in the Triple Gem Refuge. I'm Dhamma, but I also know Buddha, also know Sangha.

Joy Kirby: You look very beautiful to me. Very beautiful.

JDH: You're seeing me without your ego. I am beautiful, I am a great being. You see when you, you're now seeing me minus your ego nit-picking mind, if you know what I mean. So I'm something else.

Joy Kirby: I don't know how you've tolerated it. Yes I do.

JDH: Ah well, yes you do, because of Buddha Dhamma Sangha qualities. My sense of gratitude to Buddha Dhamma Sangha goes back a long way. And, I mean there's no way I could ever repay the kindness of all the Buddhas I've met, all the Bodhisattvas I've met. So I took Vows, like Bodhisattva Vows, a long time ago to help other beings to come and have ... Why should I have all the fun? You know, why should I have all the...

Female student: But it's lovely in here too.

JDH: Yeah, I know this is pure place, because I built it personally myself, so it's uncontaminated. And that's why all the monks say this is great place to become enlightened, they know. Good. Happy.

Female student: Yes.

JDH: So to continue at about 8.30 pm. The events occur in the, in your Samsara from time to time which are very clearly, you cognate that the Buddha Dhamma Sangha is correct. You go through, if you like Path of Gradual Enlightenment. And it all depends on doing the best you can and trying the best you can and listening to your Teacher's corrections and trying again, and so we come to this part of the commentary from Chandrakirti where he says, "In order to illustrate this point of mutual unconnectedness with an example; it is like when one sees a snake hole in the wall of one's house and one removes one's worry by saying 'There is no elephant here, and if this were to remove the fear of the snake alas how ridiculous it would seem to others".

Now, there are layers and layers of meaning on that. When the mind unbundles the ego, which is unreal, and it falls away, it just vanishes suddenly, and then the mind understands Anatta, the, the mind might say, "Ah" you know, "Thank you very much" or something or something or something, and it's not obvious to the other people what's going on, it just seems like a bit of mumbo jumbo.

If you take it at one level, this fear, a snake hole may not have a snake in it. It might be an imagined snake. But an elephant is dangerous, particularly when they get on musk; they'll trample people to death. So at one level you can say, "Don't worry about it there may not be a snake in the snake hole, but I've seen now that something more dangerous, like a wild elephant, was, was troubling me. My attention was on this small ego's fears. Because of this, I nearly wasted my whole life in Samsara. And now I see that I've removed a greater danger than my ego could ever imagine".

See the ego can't really understand the Dhamma. It can't understand that a one-minute negative kamma act could put you into hell. The ego can't understand that. I mean it will go along it says, "Oh if the texts says this", but it doesn't understand how it happens.

So we go around in a rather roundabout path now for the rest of you. This is a quote from Chandrakirti. "When one understands", and the emphasis I make again is on this word understanding as a knowledge, Anatta selflessness is a knowledge, it's not a thing. Like as the Venerable said the other day, Anatta can't be seen or touched or tasted. So it's a matter of getting a knowledge of no self. It's got to be a knowledge, a wisdom knowledge. Lokuttara supermundane wisdom knowledge [that] this is the way it is.

So you can't, it's like you can know without doubt that there never has been a self. You can know without doubt that that ego mind is so stupid, so imagined, so unreal, so, such a fantasy and yet that fantasy caused you trouble. Just as fantasizing that there might be a snake because you see the hole of the snake, a snake hole in a house, there might be a snake. There mightn't be a snake. The snake hole could have been, the snake could have died ten years ago. It's like if you saw a mouse hole, if you saw a mouse hole it doesn't mean there must be a mouse.

The ego sees something and then jumps. It's, it's like it thinks it's being sane or logical. For example if it saw a horse with a saddle on it, it would say something like this, "Oh", it would fantasize. it would say, "Oh, that horse had a rider on it and the rider's fallen off". You know, the reality is it might have been just saddled and the rider hadn’t got on the horse or something.

But the ego, once it makes one of those jumps, it then believes, "Oh, I'd better call an ambulance, I'd better call the police, there's probably a dead rider lying somewhere". It never stops to think what is true; it's not interested in what is true. It's interested in the buzz of the worst possible script. "Wow", you know, "Dead oh, oh" you know, "Wow". It always goes to the worst possible construction of what it sees.

You know, there's many stories about this, even in western literature about, someone says you know, "Oh this guy", blah blah blah, "he's buying presents", you know this guy's ... ahhh .. wife gets paranoid thinks, you know so this, and then rings up and finds he has bought flowers at the florist, he has gone to this shop and bought this bloody French perfume, he's gone to another shop he's bought this lingerie. She gets paranoid about "Who is my husband's lover?" The husband comes home that night and says, "Happy birthday dear. Here is some lingerie, some perfume, and some flowers" and her mind just goes, she had forgotten it was her own birthday. Things like that, there's plenty of those sort of stories.

But this ego mind will jump to conclusions, if you like, but what it jumps to is always defiled, you know, and that is nature, just the nature of this pitiful ego mind and yet people, of course, protect it. It has no wisdom, it is unreal, it fantasizes, it takes the worst possible case, it has no compassion in it, you can describe it in a series of negatives. This is this I my, mine me. It's got to go.

Personal selfishness is the only thing that an ego mind knows. And the goal is to get to know there is no self so something's got to give. You can't, you can't have two, you can't have a knowledge of Anatta and a personally self habit selfish mind.

When one understands selfishness, understands as a knowledge, and abandons the intellectual self; the intellectual self he's referring to is the one that says, "My husband was buying perfume, my husband was buying flowers, my husband was buying lingerie therefore I deduce he has a mistress". But the same mind forgets that it's the wife's birthday. And when the husband comes home and gives her the presents, she never says, "I will never trust that ego-centered mind again".

It's proved, the selfish mind is proved wrong and wrong. But it has no memory of its, the fact it's been proved wrong. Really stupid, like a child. So it's very strange to say that knowing selflessness will totally wipe out misknowledge. It sounds a strange statement, but you can see how it works. And this "I" habit which has been with us.

"The intelligence see absolutely all the faults of the afflictions as coming from the egoistic views", Chandrakiti says. "There's no problem here according to the dialectical system. The two self-habits are differentiated according to their objects and not according ... " and so on. So you must understand that to get omniscience, the "I" must be removed.

So the minute you see your "I" or your ‘me, me, me’, you identify with it. And the minute you identify with it you know you're on defilements.

May you come to understand selflessness.

May you come to know the sublime qualities of the Buddha Dhamma.

May you be well and happy.

May all beings be well and happy.


This script was transcribed, prepared and edited by Frank Carter, Leanne Eames, Jocelyn Hughes, Julie O’Donnell and Alec Sloman.


References:

1. Anattalakkhana Sutta, Samyutta Nikaya XXII, 59
http://www.cains.com/bucha/Anatta.htm

2. John D. Hughes Recorded Dhamma teachings.
Recording Title: Selflessness, anatta
Tape 9, Side 1
Teacher: John D. Hughes
Date of recording: 28 June 1988
Transcribed by: Frank Carter, Jocelyn Hughes
Checked by: Frank Carter
CD Reference: 28_06_88T9S1A
File Name: 28_06_88T9S1A_JDHtranscribe.rtf
5 Day Meditation Course
Tuesday 28 June 1988 6.00pm.

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